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Link dumps #128
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@almereyda thanks for rolling it over to the new year!
Very interesting thread, but I think not the same as CfA. CfA is a formalized protocol for coming to agreement (or explicitly failing to do so), and then following thru to performing and evaluating the agreed-upon actions. But it is only formalized for two agents. Doesn't work for more than two. Would be interesting to try to formalize such a protocol between many people. Roberts Rules of Order might be a starting point. But might be too formal... |
Did we know https://github.com/feramhq/transity#why-another-plain-text-accounting-tool already? |
http://patterns.dataincubator.org/book/index.html via https://github.com/semantalytics/awesome-semantic-web also seems like a standing reference. |
@almereyda I didn't, but it looks like it is basic REA, and could be easily represented in VF. |
http://pospi.spadgos.com/2019/03/26/steps-toward-the-new-resource-economy/
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Bill McCarthy asks if anybody knows any of the people working on this project: (Which looks interesting...) |
John Sowa's history of semantic languages, including RDF and its relatives:
And lots of other historical goodies... |
Digital Asset Open Sources its Smart Contract Language, DAML
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https://w3c.social/@hadleybeeman/101886808447077971
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https://blog.heroku.com/json-schema-document-debug-apis @fosterlynn is going to work on VF json schemas. |
https://jeremydormitzer.com/blog/more-than-json-activitypub-and-json-ld/
I see a lot of complaints about json-ld in the fediverse. Does this mean people are not doing it right? Or does this mean ActivityPub is under-specified? Or something else? |
The opposite of JSON-LD?
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https://notabug.org/peers/forgefed
https://notabug.org/peers/forgefed/src/master/vocabulary
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Their language and system is based on Petri Nets. https://arxiv.org/pdf/1906.07629.pdf
Easily mappable to VF... |
https://p2pfoundation.net/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/AccountingForPlanetarySurvival_def.pdf P2PF accounting for externalities, embracing REA, and a mention of VF. |
Blog post from holochain including commitment to REA and VF. |
Networks as a form of organization Alas, it's a scanned copy, not a generated pdf, so I can't quote from it. But here's a screenshot: And here's a lot more from the same author: http://woodypowell.com/research-interests#networks Here's one I can quote from: http://woodypowell.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/The_SAGE_Handbook_of_Organizational_Institutionali..._-_Chapter_17_Networks_and_Institutions.pdf
More from http://woodypowell.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/4_NetworksandEconomicLife.pdf
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Let's get out of github: |
Betreff: [AkG_Offene-Liste] open for pre-order: Value Theory: Is There Still Any Value in It? Revisiting Value and Valuation in a Globalising Digital World | Nova Science Publishers Sorry for cross-posting Dear Colleagues, Please, contact Tricia Worthington at
PS: Endorsements: Hussein Solomon, Senior Professor, University of the Free State, South Africa Arno Tausch; Innsbruck University and Corvinus University, Budapest Peter Herrmann ((Prof. Dr. habil. - HWR (Berlin, Germany). CU (Hungary), EURISPES (Italy), IASQ (The Netherlands), LSU (Russia), MPI-soc-law (Germany), NUI-M (Ireland), UEF (Finland)) AkG Mailingliste |
https://colet.space/slow-tech-movement/
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https://www.provenance.org/explore As seen in the example projects of the seventh main focus trust in the German Prototype Fund. |
The future of software, the end of apps, and why UX designers should care about type theory
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Food flows between counties in the United States
Those would be VF:Scenarios. Altho I don't know where the machine learning and linear programming come in... |
After there was recently some movement in the issues of https://git.fairkom.net/transcomm/transcomm-concept/ and within the comments of associated blog posts, it is appearing clearer that their design might find similarities in Value Flows. Lately another participant also posted https://github.com/researchstudio-sat/webofneeds It is a research project written in Java that uses RDF ontologies to provide matching services for offer and need networks, apparently running since 2013 (GitHub Contributors, Paper: Beyond Data: Building a Web of Needs). Their site has many links, to documentation, a paper, They maintain two RDF ontologies below
The It's nice to see how their interface appears quite feature complete to publish offers or requests, and includes geographical awareness plus a messaging system. It had previously been referenced from #133 (comment), valueflows/valueflows#503 (comment) and valueflows/valueflows#503 (comment) by @bhaugen and @bshambaugh |
Thanks yet again @almereyda for keeping us organized in our link dumps! I'm studying your links on this last one.... |
@almereyda we had a long email thread with Brent Shambaugh about Web of Needs when he was working on it. Re
Christian Huemer worked on WON at one point (according to that email thread) and he used to work with Bill McCarthy (and me) and knew REA. So might be more than coincidence, although I think also there are forced moves in these design spaces... |
@almereyda I love Web of Needs! Have skimmed into their ontologies once or twice on the way past and always had a curiosity to see what implementations might look like. What I find interesting personally is the idea of converting the |
And the conversation continues in researchstudio-sat/webofneeds#3183 (comment), where
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@pospi you can see the demonstrator on https://matchat.org (currently bugfixing after some refactoring - sorry about that). To see the RDF representation, there is a small link in the footer that toggles links to the RDF entities) - or you go to the list of all atoms: https://node.matchat.org/won/resource/atom Brief intro to the model: The main entity in WoN is an atom, the medium of communication is a message. Atoms are created on WoN nodes by sending a CREATE message, which is an RDF dataset containing message metadata and the RDF content for the atom. Modifying and deleting also work with such messages (REPLACE and DELETE). Messages are appended to message logs that can be cryptographically verified (1 log per atom). When the owners of two atoms want to communicate, they first have to establish a connection (using CONNECT messages). These connections are part of each atom's data, so all connection-related information is present on both sides. Each connection has an append-only message log that holds all messages that have been exchanged via the connection. Within a connection, there is a protocol for making and accepting proposals (which yields an agreement) and for cancelling agreements. An agreement is simply a set of triples that both agents have provably agreed to. It can be addressed with a URI and independently computed by each participant by applying an algorithm to the message log. We've also implemented a connection to a Petri net interpreting engine that can be used to interpret agreed-upon event data in the context of an agreed-upon petri net to calculate the state of that petri net. Connections are not made directly between atoms; rather, they are made between sockets of the atoms. A socket is just a specification of how atoms can make connections to other atoms (by specifying comptible sockets), max number of connections, etc., and what happens if a connection is established. In the demonstrator, most atoms have the ChatSocket and the HoldableSocket (the TTL representation is more interesting here). In the latter, you can see that a socket definition can specify an RDF property that will be generated in an atom's data whenever a connection is established with that socket. (For example, the HoldableSocket generates a Matchers are independent agents that keep track of atoms and send hint messages whenever they see pairs of atoms that may want to establish a connection. With these building blocks, I think it would be possible to represent the Intents in this flow with atoms, which do not need to be on the same WoN node, and maybe each has a 'conversation for action' socket or somesuch. A matcher could find the two intents and send hint messages. The atoms might establish a connection. In that conversation, they can use WoN agreements to establish mutually agreed-upon data: first, the VF commitment, and then the VF economic event. It may be weird that the event also needs an agreement, but there is no way to know if an event has happened except both agents agreeing it has - that's why. In practice, maybe you'd want another event for when the tool is given back, and maybe there is another commitment for money and events for when the money transfer has happened. Does this sound right to you? |
@fkleedorfer Sounds like a lot of possibilities here. I'm still studying your model, but have a few responses.
That seems right.
That seems right too. @pospi can respond with more detail than I can on the mutually agreed-upon data, but generally we don't have that defined in the VF vocabulary itself. In Holochain for example, that will happen, but using Holochain's facilities.
In VF, yes. |
Just wanted to say that this is really interesting work (though I admit I
wasn't able to find any listings hitting random locations in matchat.org so
I never really got to see the output). I can definitely see a lot of
parallels here, and it sounds to me as though your description of how this
maps to VF is pretty spot on. It may even be worthwhile building our
"Conversations for Action" module to fit these specs. It's also another nod
for Holochain to open their conductor API up to allow scripting requests at
the raw HTTP level (currently it's all POST to a JSONRPC socket).
I would be very interested in seeing the petri net components of this or
reading more about them... especially if this can generate visual
representations of resource flows?
…On Sat, 1 Feb 2020 at 06:03, Lynn Foster ***@***.***> wrote:
@fkleedorfer <https://github.com/fkleedorfer> Sounds like a lot of
possibilities here. I'm still studying your model, but have a few responses.
I think it would be possible to represent the Intents in this flow with
atoms,
That seems right.
The atoms might establish a connection. In that conversation, they can use
WoN agreements to establish mutually agreed-upon data: first, the VF
commitment, and then the VF economic event.
That seems right too. @pospi <https://github.com/pospi> can respond with
more detail than I can on the mutually agreed-upon data, but generally we
don't have that defined in the VF vocabulary itself. In Holochain for
example, that will happen, but using Holochain's facilities.
In practice, maybe you'd want another event for when the tool is given
back, and maybe there is another commitment for money and events for when
the money transfer has happened.
In VF, yes.
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<https://twitter.com/pospigos> | github <https://github.com/pospi> ← where
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@pospi, to see the RDF representation of WoN atoms, connections, and messages:
The petri net thing is not automatically integrated in any of the 'use cases' in the demonstrator, but if you create a petri net with PIPE and save it as xml, you can send it to a communication partner with a message, then 'propose' that message, and when the partner accepts the proposal, the GUI will show the active states and possible transitions. petrinet-taxi.xml is a petrinet that we've been using. Don't be confused by the URIs it uses from The general idea would be that a socket definition (=def of how you can connect to an atom) would somehow include a definition of the higher-level protocols that are supported by the socket. Those higher-level protocols could be linked to petri nets and ontologies (for example, for the taxi use case), and thus the GUIs would know which workflows should be made available to users, and maybe, at some point, also how to best represent state and possible transitions to the users. |
I would be really interested in stepping thru a petri net process if and when it's available. Also any other WoN petri net demos. |
We have moved the ValueFlows organization from GitHub to https://lab.allmende.io/valueflows. This issue has been closed here, and all further discussion on this issue can be done at
If you have not done so, you are very welcome to register at https://lab.allmende.io and join the ValueFlows organization there. |
Keeping up with finitely scrollable GitHub issue pages, here comes this year's slice of the infamous link dump series. #30 #91 #172 #269 #312
Starting with an article that reflects upon intents in online communities, in other words intentional communities, I'd like to direct your attention at
How does this coalesce with our intuitions around conversations for action?
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